Sherlock Holmes

[James A. Temple]

Dr. Watson, at the very end of the story "A Study in Scarlet", tries to
console Sherlock Holmes. Holmes solved the case but the credit went to two
Scotland Yard detectives who had little to do with the case. Dr. Watson
says, "In the meantime you must make yourself contented by the consciousness
of success, like the Roman miser ~ "Populus me sibilat, at mihi plaudo Ipse
domi simul ac nummos contemplar in arca."

Kindly translate the phrase for me. And, if you have any idea what Roman
miser Dr. Watson was referring to and what the source of that pronouncement
is, I would appreciate that information, too.

Thank you.

James Alderson Temple
Canton, TX

[Johannes Patruus]

Post by James A. Temple
Dr. Watson, at the very end of the story "A Study in Scarlet", tries to
console Sherlock Holmes. Holmes solved the case but the credit went to two
Scotland Yard detectives who had little to do with the case. Dr. Watson
says, "In the meantime you must make yourself contented by the

consciousness

Post by James A. Temple
of success, like the Roman miser ~ "Populus me sibilat, at mihi plaudo Ipse
domi simul ac nummos contemplar in arca."
Kindly translate the phrase for me. And, if you have any idea what Roman
miser Dr. Watson was referring to and what the source of that

pronouncement

Post by James A. Temple
is, I would appreciate that information, too.
Thank you.
James Alderson Temple
Canton, TX

It's from Horace's first book of Satires, translated here:
http://www.authorama.com/works-of-horace-6.html
where your quote in Englished thus:
"The crowd hiss me; but I applaud myself at home, as soon as I contemplate
my money in my chest."

Johannes

[Ed Cryer]

Post by Johannes Patruus
http://www.authorama.com/works-of-horace-6.html
"The crowd hiss me; but I applaud myself at home, as soon as I contemplate
my money in my chest."
Johannes

The miser is Timon of Athens. You can read all about him not only in
Shakespeare's play, but in Plutarch's short account of his life in his
biography of Mark Antony (from which Shakespeare got the story).

An English translation of Satires I can be found here;
http://ancienthistory.about.com/library/bl/bl_text_horace_sat1.htm
But there's a class of persons, led astray
By false desires, and this is what they say:
"You cannot have enough: what you possess,
That makes your value, be it more or less."
What answer would you make to such as these?
Why, let them hug their misery if they please,
Like the Athenian miser, who was wont
To meet men's curses with a hero's front:
"Folks hiss me," said he, "but myself I clap
When I tell o'er my treasures on my lap."

Ed

[James A. Temple]

Post by Ed Cryer
The miser is Timon of Athens. You can read all about him not only in
Shakespeare's play, but in Plutarch's short account of his life in his
biography of Mark Antony (from which Shakespeare got the story).
An English translation of Satires I can be found here;
http://ancienthistory.about.com/library/bl/bl_text_horace_sat1.htm
But there's a class of persons, led astray
"You cannot have enough: what you possess,
That makes your value, be it more or less."
What answer would you make to such as these?
Why, let them hug their misery if they please,
Like the Athenian miser, who was wont
"Folks hiss me," said he, "but myself I clap
When I tell o'er my treasures on my lap."

I am grateful to you, Ed, for the information that you have provided. When
I was a young man, I was ashamed of my ignorance ~ to the extent that I
would not ask questions that might reveal it. But, over the years, I've
come to understand that non-willful ignorance is an asset whenever managed
properly: It allows me to learn.

Thank you,
Jim Temple

[Ed Cryer]

Post by James A. Temple
I am grateful to you, Ed, for the information that you have provided.

When

Post by James A. Temple
I was a young man, I was ashamed of my ignorance ~ to the extent that I
would not ask questions that might reveal it. But, over the years, I've
come to understand that non-willful ignorance is an asset whenever managed
properly: It allows me to learn.
Thank you,
Jim Temple

I'm old enough to see the wisdom in this. And I hope I'm intelligent and
strong enough to be able to stick with it, even in company where you get
berated and belittled for showing any ignorance or vulnerability.

Ed

[James A. Temple]

Post by Johannes Patruus
http://www.authorama.com/works-of-horace-6.html
"The crowd hiss me; but I applaud myself at home, as soon as I contemplate
my money in my chest."

Thank you very much, Johannes. It was kind of you to take the time to
educate an old man. I am in your debt.

Best regards,
Jim Temple

[August de Man]

"James A. Temple"

Post by James A. Temple
Dr. Watson, at the very end of the story "A Study in Scarlet",

~ "Populus me sibilat, at mihi plaudo
~ Ipse domi simul ac nummos contemplar in arca."

I wondered about "contemplar", and rightly so, because Dr. Watson doesn't
cite Horace quite correctly. It should have been:

sic solitus: 'populus me sibilat, at mihi plaudo
ipse domi, simul ac nummos contemplor in arca.'

Search for "nummos contemplar" and it's all about Sherlock Holmes; search
for "nummos contemplor", and you find the Latin texts.

August de Man

[James A. Temple]

Post by August de Man
I wondered about "contemplar", and rightly so, because Dr. Watson doesn't
sic solitus: 'populus me sibilat, at mihi plaudo
ipse domi, simul ac nummos contemplor in arca.'
Search for "nummos contemplar" and it's all about Sherlock Holmes; search
for "nummos contemplor", and you find the Latin texts.

Fascinating! The text from which I copied the line attributed to Dr. Watson
was from the Easton Press publication of "The Adventures of Sherlock
Holmes". An excerpt from the title page reads, "A definitive text,
corrected and edited by Edgar W. Smith, ...". I suppose we shall never know
whether Sir Arthur Conan Doyle was responsible for the errant "letter",
followed by an oversight of Edgar W. Smith or whether Smith made the change
himself. The plot thickens.

Thank you, my friend, for your courteous input into the matter.

James A. Temple

[Johannes Patruus]

Post by James A. Temple

Post by August de Man
I wondered about "contemplar", and rightly so, because Dr. Watson doesn't
sic solitus: 'populus me sibilat, at mihi plaudo
ipse domi, simul ac nummos contemplor in arca.'
Search for "nummos contemplar" and it's all about Sherlock Holmes; search
for "nummos contemplor", and you find the Latin texts.

Fascinating! The text from which I copied the line attributed to Dr. Watson
was from the Easton Press publication of "The Adventures of Sherlock
Holmes". An excerpt from the title page reads, "A definitive text,
corrected and edited by Edgar W. Smith, ...". I suppose we shall never know
whether Sir Arthur Conan Doyle was responsible for the errant "letter",
followed by an oversight of Edgar W. Smith or whether Smith made the change
himself. The plot thickens.
Thank you, my friend, for your courteous input into the matter.

The error is touched upon in three previous threads:
http://groups-beta.google.com/groups?q=contemplar+contemplor+-james

Johannes

[James A. Temple]

Post by Johannes Patruus
http://groups-beta.google.com/groups?q=contemplar+contemplor+-james

So they are! I wonder, is there a Latin word, "contemplar"? If so, how
does it differ in meaning from "contemplor"?

Thank you for your time.

Jim Temple

[Johannes Patruus]

Post by James A. Temple

Post by Johannes Patruus
http://groups-beta.google.com/groups?q=contemplar+contemplor+-james

So they are! I wonder, is there a Latin word, "contemplar"? If so, how
does it differ in meaning from "contemplor"?
Thank you for your time.

Latin, no -
http://lysy2.archives.nd.edu/cgi-bin/words.exe?contemplar

Spanish, yes -
http://www.brainytranslation.com/translations/re/regard330143.html

Johannes

[Rolleston]

Post by Johannes Patruus
Latin, no -
http://lysy2.archives.nd.edu/cgi-bin/words.exe?contemplar

I have found no convincing instances of a Latin word "contemplar".

Personally speaking, I would tend to avoid using WW's Words as support
for any statement. I've found several errors of commision and omission
(e.g., it does not have "tussio" ("to cough")).

R.

[John Briggs]

Post by James A. Temple

Post by August de Man
I wondered about "contemplar", and rightly so, because Dr. Watson
sic solitus: 'populus me sibilat, at mihi plaudo
ipse domi, simul ac nummos contemplor in arca.'
Search for "nummos contemplar" and it's all about Sherlock Holmes;
search for "nummos contemplor", and you find the Latin texts.

Fascinating! The text from which I copied the line attributed to Dr.
Watson was from the Easton Press publication of "The Adventures of
Sherlock Holmes". An excerpt from the title page reads, "A
definitive text, corrected and edited by Edgar W. Smith, ...". I
suppose we shall never know whether Sir Arthur Conan Doyle was
responsible for the errant "letter", followed by an oversight of
Edgar W. Smith or whether Smith made the change himself. The plot
thickens.

As a general rule (and you should have learned this in the course of a long
life), it is unwise to place too much trust in what you might read on title
pages. Simple errors such as this are easily introduced by compositors when
reprinting, for example for American editions (which were often pirated).
For what it is worth, the Project Gutenberg eText version (and Project
Gutenberg are a byword for inaccuracy, mainly due to their choice of
editions) has the quotation correctly. They claim to be reproducing the
1887 text, if you can believe that :-)

[James A. Temple]

Post by John Briggs
As a general rule (and you should have learned this in the course of a
long life), it is unwise to place too much trust in what you might read on
title pages. Simple errors such as this are easily introduced by
compositors when reprinting, for example for American editions (which were
often pirated).

So true, John. It is interesting to me that the folks involved in the
alt.fan.holmes newsgroup seem to have accepted the word "contemplar" as an
accurate quote from A. Conan Doyle's novel. If they have referred to more
than one source, it seems that a small but significant mistake has been
perpetuated.

Post by John Briggs
For what it is worth, the Project Gutenberg eText version (and Project
Gutenberg are a byword for inaccuracy, mainly due to their choice of
editions) has the quotation correctly. They claim to be reproducing the
1887 text, if you can believe that :-)

Yes, I've noted that at least two eText versions have used the correct Latin
term. With the advent of computers, the grammar checks and aids built into
the software of many programs lessen the chance, it seems, of perpetuating
an error.

I'm currently reading "The Works of Andrew Gray", published in 1839. The
preface bemoans earlier editions because of the plethora of typographical
and grammatical errors. The earliest publication of the sermons of Rev.
Gray were released two hundred years earlier and based upon handwritten
notes of various members of the attending congregations. It is difficult
reading, for me, because of the incessant run-on sentences. Yet, the prose
is beautiful. There is no doubt it my mind that the books we have today that
have come from ancient sources have suffered mightily from the ravages of
translations, interpretations, and biases.

Thank you for your contribution to this small thread. I appreciate the time
you've taken.

Jim Temple

[Tim Hanke]

There is no doubt it my mind that the books we have today that have come
from ancient sources have suffered mightily from the ravages of
translations, interpretations, and biases.

Well put. I have often thought the same thing, but not formed the thought so
well.

Tim Hanke

[James A. Temple]

Post by Tim Hanke
Well put. I have often thought the same thing, but not formed the thought
so well.

Thank you, Tim. I, too, have had the opportunity on several occasions to
read or hear some loose observation of mine put in terms that expressed it
succinctly. I'm not so sure that we don't take the time to formulate our
ideas in more concrete terms.

For years, I've toyed with the idea that the very act of becoming
"civilized" insures a decline in any given culture. I've argued for and
against such a proposition, in my own mind, never coming to anything
approaching a solid opinion. Yet, one evening while reading an essay
written in 1940 by Archibald MacLeish, I came across his declaration, "There
are examples in history of civilizations rendered impotent by excesses of
culture." The point is that MacLeish had written that statement several
months before I was born. The words may have never meant anything to me had
I not toyed with the concept a various points in my life. But, my friend,
that fine essayist expressed one of my favorite ideas in just the manner
that I should like to have done.

Thank you for your kind remarks.

Jim Temple

[Tim Hanke]

one evening while reading an essay written in 1940 by Archibald MacLeish,
I came across his declaration, "There are examples in history of
civilizations rendered impotent by excesses of culture."

Or stated with Baconian pith, "Golden Ages contain matter, Silver Ages only
manners."

Tim Hanke