Translate 'Protection Through Victory' to latin?

[sigmundpetersen]

Hey,

anyone who can give me a good translation of this phrase from english
to latin?

The phrase is "Protection Through Victory".

I have found some alternatives for words through dictionaries:

Protection - ara, custodia, fides, munimentum, praesidium, tutamen,
tutela
Through - per
Victory - adorea, adoria, laureola, laurus, victoria

Any good ways to combine these? Or completely different translations?

Thanks in advance,
Sigmund

[Johannes Patruus]

Post by sigmundpetersen
Hey,
anyone who can give me a good translation of this phrase from english
to latin?
The phrase is "Protection Through Victory".
Protection - ara, custodia, fides, munimentum, praesidium, tutamen,
tutela
Through - per
Victory - adorea, adoria, laureola, laurus, victoria
Any good ways to combine these? Or completely different translations?
Thanks in advance,
Sigmund

"Vincere est defendere".
(To conquer/be victorious is to defend/protect.)

Please wait for others' suggestions.

Patruus

[Klaus Scholl]

Post by Johannes Patruus
"Vincere est defendere".
(To conquer/be victorious is to defend/protect.)

Your suggestions is good. Especially as you discarded the nominal style
and went for the verbal style, which the old romans did prefer. It's
even easier to comprehend (IMHO). Regards.

[Ed Cryer]

Post by Johannes Patruus

Post by sigmundpetersen
Hey,
anyone who can give me a good translation of this phrase from english
to latin?
The phrase is "Protection Through Victory".
Protection - ara, custodia, fides, munimentum, praesidium, tutamen,
tutela
Through - per
Victory - adorea, adoria, laureola, laurus, victoria
Any good ways to combine these? Or completely different translations?
Thanks in advance,
Sigmund

"Vincere est defendere".
(To conquer/be victorious is to defend/protect.)
Please wait for others' suggestions.
Patruus

I guess for once a non-speaker of Latin has got some good words; through
a dictionary rather than some nutty Net website. So I respectfully
suggest;
Tutela per victoriam.

"Ara" is interesting under the mantle of "protection". It means "altar",
but they were places of "sanctuary" under Roman religion just as
churches are traditionally.

For classical Latin (vivat Cicero!) "Salus in victoria" sounds better;
almost a slogan that J Caesar might have adopted.


Ed

[FGC]

Post by Ed Cryer

Post by Johannes Patruus

Post by sigmundpetersen
Hey,
anyone who can give me a good translation of this phrase from english
to latin?
The phrase is "Protection Through Victory".
Protection  - ara, custodia, fides, munimentum, praesidium, tutamen,
tutela
Through     - per
Victory      - adorea, adoria, laureola, laurus, victoria
Any good ways to combine these? Or completely different translations?
Thanks in advance,
Sigmund

"Vincere est defendere".
(To conquer/be victorious is to defend/protect.)
Please wait for others' suggestions.
Patruus

I guess for once a non-speaker of Latin has got some good words; through
a dictionary rather than some nutty Net website. So I respectfully
suggest;
Tutela per victoriam.
"Ara" is interesting under the mantle of "protection". It means "altar",
but they were places of "sanctuary" under Roman religion just as
churches are traditionally.
For classical Latin (vivat Cicero!) "Salus in victoria" sounds better;
almost a slogan that J Caesar might have adopted.
Ed- Nascondi testo citato
- Mostra testo citato -

Edo, in primis, salutem dico. Mirabilis incidentia responsi!
Vero confiteor: plane experimenta mea pliniana indigne faciunt me huic
Auctori consimilem.
Explicationem igitur praebo illius verbis, exemplo hoc: "In vino
veritas".
Intelligatur sententiam istam sicut: "Si/quando bibitur (aut cum
bibendo) vere loquitur";
identidem "In victoria salus" valeat (et anglico sermone: "When you
win [by your victory] you're safe").
FGC

[Ed Cryer]

Post by Ed Cryer

Post by Johannes Patruus

Post by sigmundpetersen
Hey,
anyone who can give me a good translation of this phrase from english
to latin?
The phrase is "Protection Through Victory".
Protection - ara, custodia, fides, munimentum, praesidium, tutamen,
tutela
Through - per
Victory - adorea, adoria, laureola, laurus, victoria
Any good ways to combine these? Or completely different
translations?
Thanks in advance,
Sigmund

"Vincere est defendere".
(To conquer/be victorious is to defend/protect.)
Please wait for others' suggestions.
Patruus

I guess for once a non-speaker of Latin has got some good words; through
a dictionary rather than some nutty Net website. So I respectfully
suggest;
Tutela per victoriam.
"Ara" is interesting under the mantle of "protection". It means "altar",
but they were places of "sanctuary" under Roman religion just as
churches are traditionally.
For classical Latin (vivat Cicero!) "Salus in victoria" sounds better;
almost a slogan that J Caesar might have adopted.
Ed- Nascondi testo citato
- Mostra testo citato -

Edo, in primis, salutem dico. Mirabilis incidentia responsi!
Vero confiteor: plane experimenta mea pliniana indigne faciunt me huic
Auctori consimilem.
Explicationem igitur praebo illius verbis, exemplo hoc: "In vino
veritas".
Intelligatur sententiam istam sicut: "Si/quando bibitur (aut cum
bibendo) vere loquitur";
identidem "In victoria salus" valeat (et anglico sermone: "When you
win [by your victory] you're safe").
FGC

*****************

Mirabilissima quidem concordia responsorum!
Which delighted me no end since you post from an Italian server and seem
to have recognised as I did in our little island on the outskirts of
Empire (Britain) that the most appropriate figure in Roman history for
this maxim would have been Julius Caesar himself! Didn't he virtually
conquer the civilised world and then declare Clementia Caesaris?
Venit, vidit, vicit; deinde clementiam omnibus pronuntiavit. :-)

Ed

[FGC]

Post by FGC

Post by Ed Cryer

Post by Johannes Patruus

Post by sigmundpetersen
Hey,
anyone who can give me a good translation of this phrase from english
to latin?
The phrase is "Protection Through Victory".
Protection - ara, custodia, fides, munimentum, praesidium, tutamen,
tutela
Through - per
Victory - adorea, adoria, laureola, laurus, victoria
Any good ways to combine these? Or completely different
translations?
Thanks in advance,
Sigmund

"Vincere est defendere".
(To conquer/be victorious is to defend/protect.)
Please wait for others' suggestions.
Patruus

I guess for once a non-speaker of Latin has got some good words; through
a dictionary rather than some nutty Net website. So I respectfully
suggest;
Tutela per victoriam.
"Ara" is interesting under the mantle of "protection". It means "altar",
but they were places of "sanctuary" under Roman religion just as
churches are traditionally.
For classical Latin (vivat Cicero!) "Salus in victoria" sounds better;
almost a slogan that J Caesar might have adopted.
Ed- Nascondi testo citato
- Mostra testo citato -

Edo, in primis, salutem dico. Mirabilis incidentia responsi!
Vero confiteor: plane experimenta mea pliniana indigne faciunt me huic
Auctori consimilem.
Explicationem igitur praebo illius verbis, exemplo hoc: "In vino
veritas".
Intelligatur sententiam istam sicut: "Si/quando bibitur (aut cum
bibendo) vere loquitur";
identidem "In victoria salus" valeat (et anglico sermone: "When you
win [by your victory] you're safe").
FGC
*****************
Mirabilissima quidem concordia responsorum!
Which delighted me no end since you post from an Italian server and seem
to have recognised as I did in our little island on the outskirts of
Empire (Britain) that the most appropriate figure in Roman history for
this maxim would have been Julius Caesar himself! Didn't he virtually
conquer the civilised world and then declare Clementia Caesaris?
Venit, vidit, vicit; deinde clementiam omnibus pronuntiavit. :-)
Ed- Nascondi testo citato
- Mostra testo citato -

Oh, no! dear Ed (thanx indeed), nothing so dramatic.
I wrote "pliniana experimenta" (all roman provinces have [quite] the
same importance); anyway, obviously besides Julius Caesar, in the
analysis of Natural History's Britain (and Thule Description; N.H.
3,30,102-104) I have to consider mainly: Vergilius, Strabo, Mela,
Diodorus, Ps. Aristoteles, Tacitus, Dionysius, Svetonius, Agathemerus,
Ptolemy, Silius, Tabula Peutingeriana, Itinerarium Antonini,
Marcianus, Orosius, Solinus, Capella, Bede (and more...), too.
FGC

[David / Amicus]

Regarding "In Victoria Salus" I can imagine a Roman coin with two
females on the reverse clasping hands.

[sigmundpetersen]

Can you elaborate a bit on that one?

Just curious :)

[Ed Cryer]

Post by sigmundpetersen
Can you elaborate a bit on that one?
Just curious :)

The Romans liked to personify all qualities, and then build a temple to
them.
Victoria and Salus were such goddesses. Many coins have one of them on
the obverse side. On the front there'd be a large head of the emperor
himself.

In a world without TV and Internet coins were good ways of spreading
propaganda.

Ed

[sigmundpetersen]

OK thanks a lot :)

[Ed Cryer]

Post by Ed Cryer
Ed- Nascondi testo citato
- Mostra testo citato -

Edo, in primis, salutem dico. Mirabilis incidentia responsi!
Vero confiteor: plane experimenta mea pliniana indigne faciunt me huic
Auctori consimilem.
Explicationem igitur praebo illius verbis, exemplo hoc: "In vino
veritas".
Intelligatur sententiam istam sicut: "Si/quando bibitur (aut cum
bibendo) vere loquitur";
identidem "In victoria salus" valeat (et anglico sermone: "When you
win [by your victory] you're safe").
FGC

****************

http://tinyurl.com/n7nb8b
eruptio Pliniana

Ed

[FGC]

Post by sigmundpetersen
Hey,
anyone who can give me a good translation of this phrase from english
to latin?
The phrase is "Protection Through Victory".
Protection  - ara, custodia, fides, munimentum, praesidium, tutamen,
tutela
Through     - per
Victory      - adorea, adoria, laureola, laurus, victoria
Any good ways to combine these? Or completely different translations?
Thanks in advance,
Sigmund

What do you think about "In Victoria Salus" ?
Maybe it's better if you consider:
"Protection" in a wider sense, and
"Through" like: "by"
(more, look at Caesar's - De Bello Gallico - expressions).
FGC

[John Townsend]

What do you think about "In Victoria Salus" ? (FGC)

If the phrase is to be rendered by "victoria" preceded by a preposition,
then my personal preference would be for "in victoria".

Perhaps my view is emotionally clouded because I recall a vivid phrase from
my university days:
"In victoria cuncta habuere" (I think). Tacitus?

So I like "In Victoria Salus". Do you suppose it could be improved by
adding "optima", e.g.
"In victoria optima salus" ? Or even drop the "in" and say "Victoria optima
salus" ?

John

[FGC]

Post by John Townsend

What do you think about "In Victoria Salus" ? (FGC)

If the phrase is to be rendered by "victoria" preceded by a preposition,
then my personal preference would be for "in victoria".
Perhaps my view is emotionally clouded because I recall a vivid phrase from
"In victoria cuncta habuere" (I think).  Tacitus?
So I like "In Victoria Salus".  Do you suppose it could be improved by
adding "optima", e.g.
"In victoria optima salus" ?  Or even drop the "in" and say "Victoria optima
salus" ?
John

Dearest John,
you can improve it as you want; anyway the meaning of "salus" can
subtend/include this adjective too.
You'll find the expression: "victoria cuncta" in Tac., Ann. 14,36; its
use and meaning are not really adaptable to the present question
("parta victoria cuncta ipsis cessura" =
parta victoria --> determined/designed victory/fate,
ipsis cuncta cessura --> to them all things will be assigned,
i.e.: after the(ir) victory they'll have the whole booty).
"Victoria optima salus" is not bad, but you have to consider in it an
obvious normally subtended "est", so: "Victory is/means complete
safety".
Salus is mainly used as: health, safety and greeting; however, maybe
you intend to translate approx. the expression: "si vis pacem para
bellum" --> "si vis pacem inimicos debella" (???).
FGC

[sigmundpetersen]

Hey guys,

thanks for some really good replies!

I have no clue at all on the latin language so i cannot follow your
latin discussions :)

I'll just pick the one that sounds best. It seems to be a majority in
favor of
'In Victoria Salus', and I think this option is a good one.

Keep on brain storming if you like, it's interesting hearing about
Roman history and
Mr. Gaius Julius Caesar.

The reason for all this is my name. My first name 'Sigmund' traces
back to 'Sigismund',
a combination of 'Sigu' and 'Munt', meaning 'Victory' and 'Protection'
respectively :)

Sigmund

[John Townsend]

Post by FGC
You'll find the expression: "victoria cuncta" in Tac., Ann. 14,36; its
use and meaning are not really adaptable to the present question
("parta victoria cuncta ipsis cessura" =
parta victoria --> determined/designed victory/fate,
ipsis cuncta cessura --> to them all things will be assigned,
i.e.: after the(ir) victory they'll have the whole booty).

Thank you, but that wasn't the passage I had in mind. It was the following:

"Nocte demum reversae legiones, quamvis plus vulnerum, eadem ciborum egestas
fatigaret, vim, sanitatem, copias, cuncta in victoria habuere". (Tacitus,
Annals, 1, 68)

I mistakenly recalled a different word order, "in victoria cuncta habuere",
but the meaning is the same. In victory they had all ...

Best wishes,

John

[Mark Rae]

Post by sigmundpetersen
Any good ways to combine these? Or completely different translations?

How about "per victoriam tutela"...?

[B. T. Raven]

Post by Mark Rae

Post by sigmundpetersen
Any good ways to combine these? Or completely different translations?

How about "per victoriam tutela"...?

This version, being the most literal, best preserves the clumsiness of
the original. But maybe it could be understood somehow in the style of
George Bush musing before the invasion, quasi in loco parentis, about to
administer a spanking, "This is going to hurt me more than you."

[sigmundpetersen]

Post by B. T. Raven

Post by Mark Rae

Post by sigmundpetersen
Any good ways to combine these? Or completely different translations?

How about "per victoriam tutela"...?

This version, being the most literal, best preserves the clumsiness of
the original. But maybe it could be understood somehow in the style of
George Bush musing before the invasion, quasi in loco parentis, about to
administer a spanking, "This is going to hurt me more than you."

Hey guys,

thanks for some really good replies!

I have no clue at all on the latin language so i cannot follow your
latin discussions :)

I'll just pick the one that sounds best. It seems to be a majority in
favor of
'In Victoria Salus', and I think this option is a good one.

Keep on brain storming if you like, it's interesting hearing about
Roman history and
Mr. Gaius Julius Caesar.

The reason for all this is my name. My first name 'Sigmund' traces
back to 'Sigismund',
a combination of 'Sigu' and 'Munt', meaning 'Victory' and 'Protection'
respectively :)


Sigmund

[Ed Cryer]

Post by B. T. Raven

Post by Mark Rae

Post by sigmundpetersen
Any good ways to combine these? Or completely different
translations?

How about "per victoriam tutela"...?

This version, being the most literal, best preserves the clumsiness of
the original. But maybe it could be understood somehow in the style of
George Bush musing before the invasion, quasi in loco parentis, about to
administer a spanking, "This is going to hurt me more than you."

Hey guys,

thanks for some really good replies!

I have no clue at all on the latin language so i cannot follow your
latin discussions :)

I'll just pick the one that sounds best. It seems to be a majority in
favor of
'In Victoria Salus', and I think this option is a good one.

Keep on brain storming if you like, it's interesting hearing about
Roman history and
Mr. Gaius Julius Caesar.

The reason for all this is my name. My first name 'Sigmund' traces
back to 'Sigismund',
a combination of 'Sigu' and 'Munt', meaning 'Victory' and 'Protection'
respectively :)


Sigmund

*******

Like Siegmund, Sieglinde & Siegfried in German myth.

My name is Edward.
This from "The Pan Book of Boys' Names";
"Weard" and "Mund" in Anglo-Saxon have identical meanings, so that
Edward, like Edmund, means "guardian of prosperity".

Edward (Custos rerum secundarum).

[B. T. Raven]

Post by sigmundpetersen

Post by B. T. Raven

Post by Mark Rae

Post by sigmundpetersen
Any good ways to combine these? Or completely different translations?

How about "per victoriam tutela"...?

This version, being the most literal, best preserves the clumsiness of
the original. But maybe it could be understood somehow in the style of
George Bush musing before the invasion, quasi in loco parentis, about to
administer a spanking, "This is going to hurt me more than you."

Hey guys,
thanks for some really good replies!
I have no clue at all on the latin language so i cannot follow your
latin discussions :)
I'll just pick the one that sounds best. It seems to be a majority in
favor of
'In Victoria Salus', and I think this option is a good one.
Keep on brain storming if you like, it's interesting hearing about
Roman history and
Mr. Gaius Julius Caesar.
The reason for all this is my name. My first name 'Sigmund' traces
back to 'Sigismund',
a combination of 'Sigu' and 'Munt', meaning 'Victory' and 'Protection'
respectively :)
Sigmund

I didn't think of that angle. Then the most literal translation is
probably the most accurate:

praesidium per victoriam
tutamen per victoriam

The order (either Victoria per praesidium or Praesidium per victoriam)
depends on whether the name means "Offense is the best defense" or
"Defense is the best offense."

Eduardus

[B. T. Raven]

Post by sigmundpetersen

Post by B. T. Raven

Post by Mark Rae

Post by sigmundpetersen
Any good ways to combine these? Or completely different translations?

How about "per victoriam tutela"...?

This version, being the most literal, best preserves the clumsiness of
the original. But maybe it could be understood somehow in the style of
George Bush musing before the invasion, quasi in loco parentis, about to
administer a spanking, "This is going to hurt me more than you."

Hey guys,
thanks for some really good replies!
I have no clue at all on the latin language so i cannot follow your
latin discussions :)
I'll just pick the one that sounds best. It seems to be a majority in
favor of
'In Victoria Salus', and I think this option is a good one.
Keep on brain storming if you like, it's interesting hearing about
Roman history and
Mr. Gaius Julius Caesar.
The reason for all this is my name. My first name 'Sigmund' traces
back to 'Sigismund',
a combination of 'Sigu' and 'Munt', meaning 'Victory' and 'Protection'
respectively :)
Sigmund

[Second try]

I didn't think of that angle. Then the most literal translation is
probably the most accurate:

praesidium per victoriam
tutamen per victoriam

The order (either Victoria per praesidium or Praesidium per victoriam)
depends on whether the name means "Offense is the best defense" or
"Defense is the best offense."

Eduardus